Mr. Specter.

Mr. O'DONNELL. Well, I would make that decision under normal circumstances. But it was almost an automatic decision, that whenever the weather was clear, he preferred to ride in an open car.

Mr. Specter.

Do you recall at approximately what time the Presidential Party arrived at Love Field, Tex.--Love Field, Dallas, Tex.?
Mr. O'DONNELL. I would think it would be around 11, 11:15. We were on time. We always allowed a few minutes at the airport, because he always shook hands with the crowd. So we left--my recollection is that we departed from Love Field approximately according to the schedule.

Mr. Specter.

What were President Kennedy's activities at Love Field?
Mr. O'DONNELL. He had no scheduled activities. It was a matter of assembling the motorcade. He got off Air Force I, and he went over to the crowd that was gathered around the rail, shook hands, went up and down.

Mr. Specter.

What type of a crowd was it with respect to size?
Mr. O'DONNELL. It was a large crowd.

Mr. Specter.

Would you tell us how the motorcade was constituted with respect to the general number of the cars and the way they were lined up, if you recall, please?
Mr. O'DONNELL. Well, I can't go more than--I got into the second car, and I didn't really look behind me. There was some controversy as to what Congressman sat in what car. We had a lot of Congressmen with us and a lot of dignitaries, and there was a lot of juggling around, which Mr. O'Brien was more involved with than I was, as to where Senator Yarborough and the Vice President and the Congressman sat. But it was a lengthy motorcade, more lengthy than normal. We always tried to keep them down as much as possible. But because of the number of Congressmen and the dignitaries involved.

Mr. Specter.

How many cars were there ahead of yours?
Mr. O'DONNELL. Well, I think there was a scout car, which was the lead, the

President's vehicle, and I was in the car right behind him, in the Secret Service followup car.

Mr. Specter.

Who else besides you was in that car?
Mr. O'DONNELL. David Powers was with me. All the rest were agents.

Mr. Specter.

Do you recall whether anything unusual occurred on the trip from Love Field down to the center of Dallas?
Mr. O'DONNELL. No; I thought it was normal--the crowds, going through the suburbs, were, I would say, from medium to heavy for that trip. I noted they were mostly white collar, mostly industrial places we passed by which I would say were highly technical. Therefore, the crowd reflected a middle to an upper class type. They were not unfriendly nor terribly enthusiastic. They waved. But were reserved, I thought.

Mr. Specter.

Where were you seated in the car?
Mr. O'DONNELL. I was seated in the front jump seat--the jump seat.

Mr. Specter.

On the left-hand side or the right-hand side?
Mr. O'DONNELL. Left-hand side.

Mr. Specter.

And who sat on your immediate right?
Mr. O'DONNELL. Mr. Powers.

Mr. Specter.

How many agents were there in front of you?
Mr. O'DONNELL. Well, there were the normal two or sometimes three in the front seat. I would not be clear as to how many there were. I would think there were about--just guessing--seven or eight agents in the car. Some on the running board, some seated, depending on the speed of the motorcade, or the activity.

Mr. Specter.

Was there a front seat in the car, immediately ahead of you?
Mr. O'DONNELL. Yes.

Mr. Specter.

And was that occupied by Secret Service agents?
Mr. O'DONNELL. It was.

Mr. Specter.

And how about immediately to your rear? Was there a rear seat?
Mr. O'DONNELL. There was a rear seat. There were agents in that--again depending on the speed of the motorcade they were either on the running board, or as it slows up and the crowds got larger the agents would get on the running board. But as it moved along rather rapidly, as it did on the way in, they were seated most of the time.