Mr. Hubert.

was a movement over here [indicating]. I couldn't tell what it was. I could tell there was a movement.

Mr. Hubert.

By "over here," you mean.
Captain MARTIN. On the ramp.

Mr. Hubert.

What side of the ramp? The basement--the garage?
Captain MARTIN. The garage. The garage side. Evidently Ruby was standing right here [indicating].

Mr. Hubert.

Now, when you say "here," you'd better put a mark and put a little arrow to it, your best recollection as to where Ruby must have been. You didn't see Ruby
Captain MARTIN. No, no; this is just supposition. He had to be right in here somewhere.

Mr. Hubert.

In other words, just put a mark and a line and indicate where he was.
Captain MARTIN. I didn't see him, but he had to be right there [indicating]. There is no question about that.

Mr. HUBERT. You did see someone come from that position ?
Captain MARTIN. It was a movement. I didn't see anybody, but there was a movement in there that I could detect, and then the shot was fired.

Mr. Hubert.

What did you write here
Captain MARTIN. "Ruby before the shooting." Or, "immediately before."

Mr. Hubert.

All right, just tell us what you observed?
Captain MARTIN. Well, as soon as the shot was fired, of course, it dumbfounded me, and I tried to get through the people there on my right, to get over there to it, and there was a lot of confusion in there, and I had trouble getting through the press, and when I did get through they had already taken Ruby into the jail office and Oswald was also in the jail office. Ruby was down on the floor just inside the jail, and Oswald was lying on the north side of the jail office.

Mr. Hubert.

Well, now, when Oswald first came out of the jail office with Graves and Leavelle, were you looking at him ?
Captain MARTIN. I Saw him come out. Now, whether it was--it was shortly after they come out--I saw him after the shot was fired.

Mr. Hubert.

You were looking towards him ?
Captain MARTIN. Yes; I thought they were coming all around me and go up by me and go up to the armored car, that is what I had in mind.

Mr. Hubert.

You were not aware that the plans had been changed so that they--he was going to be taken in a police car, rather than in the armored car?
Captain MARTIN. No; I didn't know anything about it.

Mr. Hubert.

But, did you know anything about the route that was going to be used?
Captain MARTIN. No, as far as I knew, they were going to put him in the armored truck. That is the reason I was standing there, because I figured they would come right back there and I could go up there with them, but they didn't ever make it.

Mr. Hubert.

Did you observe what other officers were doing, or in what direction they were looking about the time that Oswald came out?
Captain MARTIN. No; I didn't personally observe it, except on TV later. At the time I didn't notice them.

Mr. HUBERT. In other words, at the time that Oswald came out, you were looking where you were looking towards Oswald, and if I understand it, you are not in a position to tell us now what other people were doing except what
you saw later on television, is that right?
Captain MARTIN. That's right.

Mr. Hubert.

Well, now do you have. any comment about what you saw on--later on television?
Captain MARTIN. Well, it seems that all the officers were watching Oswald when they should have been watching the crowd.

Mr. Hubert.

But, that impression you formed by looking at the television coverage of
Captain MARTIN. Yes.

Mr. Hubert.

And, you did not form that impression at the time the shot was